# Offered a contract extension with no payrise



## poiu (Nov 1, 2011)

Hello,

2 weeks ago my employer told me to "expect a letter" offering a contract extension, I said I would be interested in extending but would need to think about it.

Today the letter arrives (we're now 3 months from the initial contract's end date) and it's just a letter asking me to "sign and return" to extend. So no payrise proposed and there is also a cheeky sentance stating the number of days leave (which is a cut of 6 days!). The letter also states that if I don't reply within 2 weeks I will have accepted the new contract anyway?!

We go through a review process for bonusses and I've been given good feedback (I'm expecting at least 4 out of 5 in appraisal) and they've obviously bothered to try to renew this nice and early so I'm getting mixed messages.

Is this all normal? - I work for a large blue-chip with a very good reputation as an emplyer so I was assuming I wouldn't have to go through a messy negotiation period. I was expecting a "take-it-or-leave-it" offer of 3-5% with no mucking about.

I'm new to this contracting game so I would be very grateful for your thoughts! 

Thanks,

Poiu

p.s. this is all arrange through the employer, there's no recruitment agency involved


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## Jonmo1 (Nov 1, 2011)

When you're a contracter, you really have 2 employers..


You actually work for, and recieve paychecks from Company A
Company B works out a contract with Company A for your services.
Company B becomes your client, not your employer.
Your employer is still company A.


Who is offering the extention on the contract?
Company A (employer who writes your paycheck) or Company B (your client)


Its my experience as a contractor, that pay raises come from company A.
Company B has nothing to do with how much I am paid.
Company B pays Company A for the contract
Company A pays me.


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## poiu (Nov 1, 2011)

Hi Jonmo,

Whilst I was introduced by a recruitment agency they are on strict instructions not to contact me since the start of my initial contract. So they got just a one-off introduction fee - I have no legal relationship with them since my initial start-date.

I'm payrolled by the same company that I physically work for.

This is a fixed-term permanent contract as opposed to working through a limited company (I'm in the UK) - so I have all the same employment status as their permanent members of staff, it's just that my contract has a defined end date.

Thanks,

Poiu

p.s. sorry I forgot to say - I've been working for them for 6.5 months so far, the proposal is to extend for an extra year.


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## alansidman (Nov 1, 2011)

My experience as a contractor is that you agree to payment scenario for a project that usually does not change the rate of payment.  In these times, companies are not quick to increase payments but rather decrease them.

It seems to me that you have two choices.  Take it or leave it.  Things to consider:   


If you choose to ask for a raise, then are you prepared to walk, if you don't get what you want?
Are there opportunity to become a full time employee?  Is this something you want?  What chances if you appear to be disgruntled?
Alan


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## RoryA (Nov 1, 2011)

I'm not a lawyer, but I would suggest that if your initial contract had nothing about an automatic extension, there is nothing to suggest that you can have your contract extended by default (i.e. if you don't reply within the 2 weeks).
On the other hand, in the current climate, I'd probably take the job, depending on what, if any, notice period is applicable and whether it's a nice place to be.


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## poiu (Nov 1, 2011)

Thanks guys, much appreciated.

I think I may politely (baring in mind I sit next to my manager!) point out that it isn't a great offer and ask if the leave reduction was a mistake, and then if the reply isn't great I'll just say that I'm willing to continue for the time being. And then start looking for new work (I've changed careers so am playing catchup and have no mortgage/kids so am minded to take some risks).

If I was to extend the contract do you think it would be very controversial to leave part way through (the notice period in the contract is 4 weeks)? (my concern being a good reference).

(this contract isn't really for a specific vba project - it's just a new accounts department that has a glut of vba tasks before things settle down so my leaving wouldn't cause a massive strategic problem for them).

Thanks,

Poiu

p.s. 



> I'm not a lawyer, but I would suggest that if your initial contract had nothing about an automatic extension, there is nothing to suggest that you can have your contract extended by default (i.e. if you don't reply within the 2 weeks).


 
I've done a (brief!) contract law exam and yes I think you're right - contracts legally only exist if there are two parts, an offer by one party and an acceptance by the other party so no you can't impose a contract on someone just because they haven't replied. I guess it's just a HR guy playing games to pressure for a quick response so that they have time to hire someone else if they answer is no. But they're burning a lot of good will and I don't think it was in company's interests in the greater scheme of things.


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## Expiry (Nov 2, 2011)

I think the issue you have with this is that you've started with the thinking of a full-time employee, ie. You've had good appraisal, therefore you expect a pay rise. But you're not an employee, you're on a contract and like any other contract, there's negotiation to be had and both parties are trying to get the best deal they can.

If someone painted the front of my house for £300, and I said "that's a great job, can you do the back?" I'd expect him to ask for another £300, not tell me he did a great job of the front, therefore I should pay him £350 for the back.

Everything's open to negotiation, and as long as you're prepared to take the risk and walk, then negotiate.


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## Jonmo1 (Nov 2, 2011)

Expiry said:


> If someone painted the front of my house for £300, and I said "that's a great job, can you do the back?" I'd expect him to ask for another £300, not tell me he did a great job of the front, therefore I should pay him £350 for the back.


 
That's a great analogy


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## RoryA (Nov 2, 2011)

But equally, you wouldn't expect someone to say: "you've done a great job on the front, now do the back for the same money but you can't have weekends off."


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## Expiry (Nov 3, 2011)

rorya said:


> But equally, you wouldn't expect someone to say: "you've done a great job on the front, now do the back for the same money but you can't have weekends off."



But, that's where the negotiation comes in. You then decide if you want to accept that, negotiate a better deal, but risk the negotiation back firing, or respectfully decline and go knock at next door in the hope that they've seen what a great job you did of the wall and that they want their wall doing for £300 with weekends off, company ladder, free paintbrushes etc.


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## slay0r (Nov 18, 2011)

I've had experience of something similar, I tried to negotiate and it failed, I therefore accepted their offer straight afterwards and then just looked for jobs elsewhere.

I'd suggest just speaking to them about the holiday offer and ask them about the future and what they see you doing. If it's not as positive as you'd like, I'd suggest just signing the contract and looking elsewhere.

If they don't value your skills I'm sure plenty of companies would, just make sure you go from your job to another job without quitting!

Oh and I do have to say, that's not legal at all with the 2 week thing, previous employer tried that on my colleague and she just threatened them with legal action and they backed off immediately. These HR people seem to have no legal backgrounds in that sense!


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## poiu (Nov 18, 2011)

Thanks Slayor - did the following employer find it controversial that you left part-way through a (fixed-term?) contract? or is it seen just the same as leaving a permanent job? which country are you in?


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## slay0r (Nov 21, 2011)

They did at first but as I explained to them, the terms they had given me weren't the ones I was looking for. I hadn't taken any days off for interviews and the way I put it was that in the current market, I'd much rather have a permanent contract and have the stability that comes with it rather than have a job that although is decent, isn't guarenteed long term and that doesn't suit your ambitions. Rather than both sides be unhappy I thought it was best to leave. 

When I put it that way they let me only work 2 weeks of my notice period so it must have gone down well enough, I got a good reference for my work, that's the main thing.


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## Dryver14 (Nov 25, 2011)

Im my experience very few companies follow up on references.

The recruiting process is such that the decision has already been made.
They like a referee name but thats it. The points raised about seeking clarity with regard to holidays is valid, just guessing but on slightly above average UK pay you are talking about a £1000 pay cut and you may decide that in fact you would prefer not to have the money but the time off in which case you could request at leat one week - 5 days - remain in the contract unpaid.


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