# Time Travel



## MrIfOnly (Jan 26, 2017)

This is a thinking exercise that will challenge everything you think you know about the tools we use to make our lives easier.  I've been thinking about this on and off for sometime now, and have come to the conclusion that I know squat...

Say you travel back in time.  Just you and the clothes on your back (I don't want to picture any of you naked ).  Any time you choose, as long as it was before you were born.  Don't concern yourself with how.  Nor should you consider any paradox problems.  You can go anywhere in the world as long as humans already populate that area. Don't get caught up in religious or political issues of the time.  And no advising Napoleon Bonaparte not to go to Moscow or whispering in the ear of Julius Caesar to beware the Ides of March (they'll both ignore you anyway).  Your goal is to change history through technology, or less loftily: make yourself comfortable/rich/powerful.  Innovate, invent, industrialize.  Use your expertise and knowledge of tools, mechanics, physics, chemistry, etc.  And feel free to steal ideas from those who came before you (or, rather, will come after you).

One example that I've thought of:

Light up the dark ages in Northern Europe: I could use waterwheels to generate electricity.  I would learn from Edison's mistake and use AC instead of DC to distribute power to the local lord's castle.  Mold-blown glass was already being used, so I could devise rudimentary incandescent light bulbs.
Problems: Although copper was readily mined and refined during the period, I would have no idea how to extrude large quantities of wire for the coils. Same holds true for mass-producing the filaments for the bulbs.

As you can see from this simple example, seemingly simple inventions rely on knowledge and resources you may not have.  Let's say you are a master car mechanic.  You can build an engine from scratch.  But would you be able to instruct the population of the period you travel back to how to construct a boring machine to make your cylinders?  Do you have any idea how to refine gasoline?

The more I've thought about this, the more I realize that history unfolded the way it did for very good reasons.  Almost nothing that humans invented, save perhaps fire, was created without stepping stones that took years, even centuries in the making.  As the great Isaac Newton observed: "If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."

One more thing: your knowledge of VBA is useless! 

Regards,

CJ


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## J.Ty. (Jan 27, 2017)

For sure:

Psychology will transfer, including all forms of psychotherapy, manipulation techniques, etc.
Many methods of physiotherapy will transfer.
Many methods of sports training will transfer (imagine how rich you could become by introducing new, effective methods of improving strength of warriors)
Much of physical geography will transfer (you simply *know* that there is America on the other side of Atlantic, you *know* where salt, sulphur, oil, iron ore can be found, etc.)
Simple hygiene will transfer (use boiling water or alcohol for disinfection, wash hands before preparing food, etc.)
Simple school algebra will transfer, allowing you to become a merchant

Unless they kill you immediately for possessing supernatural knowledge, certainly obtained form devil. 

J.Ty.


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## Eric W (Jan 27, 2017)

Interesting question, that I've thought about, and so have many science fiction writers.  Personally, I doubt that I'd make a huge impact, depending on how far back I'd go, but probably some things would carry over.  As J. Ty suggested, the germ theory of medicine only goes back about 150 years.  If you could get people to adopt it, it would make a huge impact.  Typically in wars, more soldiers were lost to disease and unsanitary conditions than battles.  Plus some things like blood typing.  Probably there would be odds and ends which we take for granted, that would jump out at us.  As a former pilot, I have a pretty good grasp of the principles behind flight, so that might have an impact.

Here are a few series that tackle that question in different ways:

The Cross-Time Engineer, by Leo Frankowski.  This tackles an engineer sent back to 1231 Poland, just in time to stop the Mongol invasion.  Given the premise, the treatment is plausible.  It also considers the idea that if you go back far enough, you may not be able to communicate.  Old English isn't that similar to Modern English, but Polish has remained stable for centuries.

Island in the Sea of Time, by S.M. Stirling.  The entire island of Nantucket goes back to 1250 B.C.  Somewhat larger knowledge base, and some infrastructure.

The Lost Regiment, by William R. Forstchen.  A civil war era regiment is transported to another planet with middle-ages era humans, and they bootstrap the technology to fight the evil overlords.

I've read all three, all very good and well researched.


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## J.Ty. (Jan 27, 2017)

Eric W said:


> Old English isn't that similar to Modern English, but Polish has remained stable for centuries.



Being Polish myself, I do not agree. I am afraid I could not communicate easily in in Poland of 13th century. 

J.Ty.


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## Eric W (Jan 27, 2017)

I'll take your word for it!  I got my info from that book, and it's very possible that he embellished some facts for a good story.


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## MrIfOnly (Jan 27, 2017)

J.Ty. said:


> For sure:
> 
> Psychology will transfer, including all forms of psychotherapy, manipulation techniques, etc.
> Many methods of physiotherapy will transfer.
> ...



Good points.  I think any kind of medical knowledge will transfer better than most other disciplines.  Wish I knew how to make penicillin!


As for land on the other side of the Atlantic: Blasphemy!

Regards,

CJ


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## MrIfOnly (Jan 27, 2017)

Eric W said:


> Interesting question, that I've thought about, and so have many science fiction writers.  Personally, I doubt that I'd make a huge impact, depending on how far back I'd go, but probably some things would carry over.  As J. Ty suggested, the germ theory of medicine only goes back about 150 years.  If you could get people to adopt it, it would make a huge impact.  Typically in wars, more soldiers were lost to disease and unsanitary conditions than battles.  Plus some things like blood typing.  Probably there would be odds and ends which we take for granted, that would jump out at us.  As a former pilot, I have a pretty good grasp of the principles behind flight, so that might have an impact.
> 
> Here are a few series that tackle that question in different ways:
> 
> ...



I'll have to check those books out.  A Yankee in King Arthur's Court by Mark Twain was a good one too and probably got me thinking along these lines.

As for the language aspect, it reminds me of a problem that was posed a few years back:  How do we marker radioactive waste dumps so that generations, say 5000  years in the future will know not to dig there.  It's assumed that all current languages will be dead or unrecognizable.  And symbology like our radioactive sign or skull and crossbones may just invoke curiosity.

Regards,

CJ


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## wetbank17 (Jan 31, 2017)

MrIfOnly said:


> One more thing: your knowledge of VBA is useless!
> 
> Regards,
> 
> CJ




haha well i guess you're right... VBA knowledge is could not exactly be used to change the course of history.... but it can make you better at your job 

Cheers!


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## GJSBED (Feb 6, 2017)

If the aim is to make yourself rich, then head back with knowledge of the lowest and highest share prices of  blue-chip companies and play the market.

What if I suggest to Edison experimenting with Tungsten in his light bulbs instead of carbon, and advance light bulb tech by 20 years... will that make a brighter future?

Or imagine a major financial decision was made in the last 30 years based on a piece of VBA, what havoc could i wreak on mankind by changing a line or two?


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## gsistek (Feb 6, 2017)

I think Joe Rogan sums it up nicely in his stand up when he's explaining that we aren't smart, we just buy stuff from smart people. He says, "If I left you in the middle of the woods with nothing but a hatchet, how long until you could send me an email?"


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## MrIfOnly (Feb 7, 2017)

I had no idea Joe Rogan did stand up.  For someone who once made his living getting hit in the head, he sure is a smart guy.


GJSBED:  I wonder if going back in time and playing the stock market would have the same effect as the observer effect in physics. 

Regards,

CJ


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## wetbank17 (Feb 14, 2017)

I think so... wouldn't _any_ action in time travel cause the observer effect in physics?


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## MrIfOnly (Feb 14, 2017)

There'd definitely be some strange phenomenon that'd be hard to predict.  It's a **** good thing time travel isn't possible...or is it?


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## Scott T (Feb 14, 2017)

MrIfOnly said:


> There'd definitely be some strange phenomenon that'd be hard to predict.  It's a **** good thing time travel isn't possible...or is it?



Having just returned form the future I can tell you that time travel is not possible


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## Atroxell (Mar 9, 2017)

Ok, I guess I will deflect the topic a little bit by adding my 2 cents. And you may call me crazy after readind this.

Feel free to respond or not, depending on the level of interest, as this really is not true to the OP's premise.

Time travel is, I believe, possible. We do not know HOW yet, but we have seen it.

I prefer to believe that the "aliens" and "UFOs" that people are reporting are nothing but our distant future descendants, coming back in time to perform experiments. I find that a lot more believable than someone building a ship to travel hundreds of trillions of miles in the hope of finding _anyone _out there...At least until someone demonstrates that FTL travel is possible without sucking an entire solar system dry of its energy.


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## MrIfOnly (Mar 10, 2017)

Yeah...you're crazy!  Next thing you'll try to tell me that Klingon isn't a real language! 


P.S. Read Scott T's signature above for more evidence that FTL travel exists.


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## Atroxell (Mar 13, 2017)

I guess Scott sealed that one up for all of us.


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