# Next US President



## SteveO59L (Nov 4, 2008)

Obama or McCain ?


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## cornflakegirl (Nov 4, 2008)

Almost definitely.


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## riaz (Nov 4, 2008)

cornflakegirl said:


> Al most definitely.



Emma, Al is not in the running....


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## Gerald Higgins (Nov 4, 2008)

On Google, 

"Barack Obama" and "Excel" - 606,000 results
"John McCain" and "Excel" - 517,000 results.

I think that says it all.


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## Gerald Higgins (Nov 4, 2008)

On the other hand, check . . . 

```
=IF("Barack Obama">"John McCain","Barack Obama","John McCain")
```


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## Expiry (Nov 4, 2008)

Is this the official US election? 

If it is, then I'm not sure I'm eligible to click on one or t'other.

If not, then I'll go McCain. Obama oven chips are terrible.


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## Patience (Nov 4, 2008)

Gerald Higgins said:


> On the other hand, check . . .
> 
> ```
> =IF("Barack Obama">"John McCain","Barack Obama","John McCain")
> ```




My goodness - even Excel has turned against us!!!


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## Gerald Higgins (Nov 4, 2008)

```
=if(areas(choose("obama"))> areas(choose("mccain")),replace("w",1,1,"obama"),
replace("w",1,1,"mccain"))
```


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## Norie (Nov 4, 2008)

Gerald

Too few arguments.


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## riaz (Nov 4, 2008)

Norie said:


> Gerald
> 
> Too few arguments.



Maybe because the time for arguments is past?


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## starl (Nov 4, 2008)

*Official announcement*

ok - this thread and poll will be allowed as long as it does not get into ANY arguments. Be silly if you like (and knowing this crowd...  )
But no flaming!!!! no links to any political bashing. Any such posts will be deleted without warning. And if it gets out of hand, the thread will be removed.

The old-timers can tell you... threads like this can cause major trouble...


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## Richard Schollar (Nov 4, 2008)

*Re: Official announcement*



starl said:


> The old-timers can tell you... threads like this can cause major trouble...


 

You're just sore 'cos Hilary didn't win the Democratic nomination...


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## DonkeyOte (Nov 4, 2008)

Mr Schollar -- risky -- especially for an "old timer" (in all senses)


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## starl (Nov 4, 2008)

*Re: Official announcement*

Actually Richard, with thinking along those lines - I'd have to vote for Hillary cause of gender, but then I'd have to vote for Obama cause of my race.

So which has priority? 

ps - s'ok, Donkey - Richard knows me a bit. Can get away with some stuff. Else, I just ban him  It's good to be the power!


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## Smitty (Nov 4, 2008)

*Re: Official announcement*

I wish Frank Zappa were still alive.  He'd get my vote.

Too bad Ted Nugent didn't run.


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## SydneyGeek (Nov 4, 2008)

Heard a snippet on the radio this morning. 

Guy goes up to a touch-screen and presses the option to vote Obama. Machine says "That's one vote for McCain!"
"No!" Says the voter and clicks twice.
"Two more votes for McCain!"
"No!" Says the voter and clicks three times
"Another three votes for _President_ McCain!"

Denis


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## Smitty (Nov 4, 2008)

I made a "Florida" voting user form a while back with two buttons, but only one choice:

<font face=Tahoma><SPAN style="color:#00007F">Private</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Sub</SPAN> CommandButton1_MouseMove(<SPAN style="color:#00007F">ByVal</SPAN> Button <SPAN style="color:#00007F">As</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Integer</SPAN>, <SPAN style="color:#00007F">ByVal</SPAN> Shift <SPAN style="color:#00007F">As</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Integer</SPAN>, _<br>ByVal X <SPAN style="color:#00007F">As</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Single</SPAN>, <SPAN style="color:#00007F">ByVal</SPAN> Y <SPAN style="color:#00007F">As</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Single</SPAN>)<br>    <SPAN style="color:#00007F">If</SPAN> CommandButton1.Caption = "Kerry" <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Then</SPAN><br>        CommandButton1.Caption = "Bush"<br>        CommandButton2.Caption = "Kerry"<br>    <SPAN style="color:#00007F">End</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">If</SPAN><br><SPAN style="color:#00007F">End</SPAN> <SPAN style="color:#00007F">Sub</SPAN></FONT>

As the button captions would change with the mouse over. *EG*

It had my bosses rolling anyways.


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## DonkeyOte (Nov 4, 2008)

ha -- am tempted to stay up here in the UK to watch it but the last time I stayed up to watch a US dead cert bring home the bacon Eli Manning walked off with the MVP award... not sure I could go through all that malarkey again...


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## Norie (Nov 4, 2008)

DonkeyOte

Try staying up.

It might actually help get you to sleep.

I know the baseball the other night did for me.

Mind you I didn't find out the result till about 2 days later when it filtered through to the printed press.


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## Smitty (Nov 4, 2008)

Nah, sleep through it and wait for the surprise.

The best next day comment I ever heard was my (Mexican) ranch hand up on a ranch in Wyoming, when I told him that Bill Clinton had won:

"Beeel Clintone?  Awwwww sheeeeet..."


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## Von Pookie (Nov 4, 2008)

SydneyGeek said:


> Heard a snippet on the radio this morning.
> 
> Guy goes up to a touch-screen and presses the option to vote Obama. Machine says "That's one vote for McCain!"
> "No!" Says the voter and clicks twice.
> ...



That was from last Sunday's _Simpsons_ episode, actually.  Treehouse of Horror *19* (sheesh, I feel old).


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## SydneyGeek (Nov 4, 2008)

Kristy, thought I recognised the voice!

Simpsons or not, it looks at this stage like Obama's in.
Denis


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## SydneyGeek (Nov 5, 2008)

Just wondering if someone could enlighten a confused Aussie... how can Obama have a landslide when he only got 52% of the vote?

Denis


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## cornflakegirl (Nov 5, 2008)

Presumably the same way that Bush won when most people voted for the other guy?


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## cornflakegirl (Nov 5, 2008)

(Just in case it was a serious question, here's an explanation of the Electoral College.)


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## SydneyGeek (Nov 5, 2008)

Thanks Emma -- for both answers 

Looking at the map on the link you provided, Obama won about half the States. He just managed to win the big ones, which is what made the difference. 

Denis


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## SteveO59L (Nov 5, 2008)

As Orwell (nearly) said


"All votes are equal, but some are more equal than others"


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## cornflakegirl (Nov 5, 2008)

I always thought it was quite a mad system - but reading the explanation given of why one person one vote was rejected, it actually makes a lot more sense that it was the best system at the time.


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## Jonmo1 (Nov 5, 2008)

Yep, at a first impression, the elecoral college system looks very unfair.  And many people look at it to mean that their vote doesn't really matter.  But it does make sense.  It is intended to give the small less populated states an equal voice to the larger more populated states.  

Otherwise, a candidate could probably campaing in just a few heavily populated areas say New York, California and Texas.  And would win more popular votes than a candidate who won Several small states like Hawaii, Utah, Rhode Island, New Mexico, Vermont, New Hampshire.

In reality it seems more fair that those two scenarios should be about equal.


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## Long Nose (Nov 5, 2008)

I think "jitters" would be the word to describe America today.


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## Greg Truby (Nov 5, 2008)

Denis,

Both the U.S.'s primary election system (to choose each party's candidate) and the electoral college system result in some interesting imbalances in distribution of the candidates' time. In the general election, states like Iowa & New Hampshire get some attention but not a lot. Their number of electors is low enough that losing either or both would seldom put an election in jeapordy. However they get an extreme amount of attention during the primary season because their primaries are the earliest and winning them boosts the candidate's credibility (which helps in fundraising, but may or may not be a good indicator of later success). 

Due to the electoral college system, McCain basically ceded California (#1 in electoral votes) & New York (#3) to Obama and Obama essentially ceded Texas (#2) to McCain. However, Florida was not so lucky. Being #4 and winnable by either, it got lots of attention.

I grew up in Kansas, which (a) has few electoral votes and (b) has only voted democratic in two presidential elections in the past century. This means that I saw virtually zero presidental ad campaigns growing up. Indeed, the center strip of Kansas, Nebraska, South Dakota & North Dakota are pretty much ceded by the Democrats from the start. None of them has voted Democratic more than once since 1940. Although Nebraska is a bit of an odd duck -- they are the only state to have a unicameral legislature and they (along with Maine) are the only states that do not allocate their electoral votes on a winner-take-all basis.

Contrast Kansas to my current residence of Missouri. Missouri is frequently one of a handful of "battleground" states. We were frequently visited by both candidates and the barrage of ads on TV and radio was truly unrelenting.  I, for one, am looking forward to a few weeks with no political ads!



Long Nose said:


> I think "jitters" would be the word to describe America today.


 
Personally, I have not sensed a great deal of jitters on the part of most folks in my neck of the woods. I think most Americans could see the writing on the wall. If you know anything about politics and looked at the electoral map, the string of states that McCain would have had to have won to make it to 270 electors was so improbable that few had any real expectation that he would pull if off. Obama could afford to lose one or two or three key states and still could get to 270. McCain had zero cushion.


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## Long Nose (Nov 5, 2008)

No, not jitters in who won, but "Jitters" in like, 

What does Obama mean when he said:

-Heavily funded civilian militia
-Bankrupt the coal industry
-A fundamentally flawed Constitution
-Brother's keeper
-Redistribution of wealth
-Everyone needs to make sacrifices
-Immediate new spending
-Trade restrictions + Higher taxes
-If they bring a knife, we'll bring a gun
-Tax increases for those making more than...300K, 250K, 150K, 97K, ?K
-Change

Those are the jitters.


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## Smitty (Nov 5, 2008)

> If you know anything about politics and looked at the electoral map, the string of states that McCain would have had to have won to make it to 270 electors was so improbable that few had any real expectation that he would pull if off. Obama could afford to lose one or two or three key states and still could get to 270. McCain had zero cushion.


Unfortunately, that writing was spray painted in 10' letters on the wall.  Not to many of my co-workers (who voted in both directions) seemed to grasp it though.



> -Everyone needs to make sacrifices


Yippee!  That'll coincide nicely with the pay cuts we're about to take here.


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## Long Nose (Nov 5, 2008)

Smitty said:


> Unfortunately, that writing was spray painted in 10' letters on the wall.  Not to many of my co-workers (who voted in both directions) seemed to grasp it though.
> 
> Yippee!  That'll coincide nicely with the pay cuts we're about to take here.



I get the jitters not knowing what kind of country we need to change into to make Michelle Obama proud.


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## starl (Nov 5, 2008)

Just a reminder to keep this polite.... if you want to post your political feelings, I'm sure there are lots of political forums out there.


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## NateO (Nov 5, 2008)

Right, this forum is not intended for heated political debate or, to be honest, critical thinking of any kind. It's a Lounge, intended for light-hearted banter, nothing more.

If you have more to offer the World than the charter of this forum, that is fair enough. But, in turn, it's your responsibility to find the forum that's appropriate for that, and I assure you, it isn't on this server.


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## Long Nose (Nov 5, 2008)

I didn't get much sleep last night.  I need more coffee.  Somebody just kick me in the pants.

Tonight bonfires yes, no fireworks though.

Happy Guy Fawkes Day.


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## Greg Truby (Nov 5, 2008)

Here in the U.S., whenever the press mentions foreign countries and their take on this election, the U.S. press emphasizes that foreigners the world over see Obama's election as having something of a redemptive effect. And that it restores the view of our as a country where anything is possible.

I'm curious. Is this really how most folks overseas felt? Or is that a bunch of malarkey? Indeed, did the world pay a lot of attention? We're told it did, but our press - while free - ain't always accurate.


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## Gerald Higgins (Nov 5, 2008)

Greg - I strongly support the comments in this thread about not getting too bogged down in political argument. This ain't the place for that.

Having said that, in response to your question in post #38, here in the UK at least, my impression is that the brief answer is YES (yes, that's how folks overseas felt, and yes, we paid some attention).


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## barry houdini (Nov 5, 2008)

Greg Truby said:


> Here in the U.S., whenever the press mentions foreign countries and their take on this election, the U.S. press emphasizes that foreigners the world over see Obama's election as having something of a redemptive effect. And that it restores the view of our as a country where anything is possible.
> 
> I'm curious. Is this really how most folks overseas felt? Or is that a bunch of malarkey? Indeed, did the world pay a lot of attention? We're told it did, but our press - while free - ain't always accurate.


 
Salutations Greg!

I'm not sure most Brits have more than a sketchy idea how US politics works, but I think there's a general feeling that McCain would be "more of the same" whereas Obama is seen as a breath of fresh air.

However, that was how many here viewed the election of Tony Blair in 1997........it didn't really work out that way 

From a coverage point of view it was pretty massive here.....and still is. The main evening (10 PM) BBC news is on right now, I expect most of it (20 of 30 minutes) to be devoted to the US elections.

Our main TV channels had coverage through the night last night and it was virtually the only news on newspaper front pages this morning.

I don't know about the rest of Europe but I expect it would have been pretty similar there.


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## Greg Truby (Nov 5, 2008)

Gerald Higgins said:


> Greg - I strongly support the comments in this thread about not getting too bogged down in political argument. This ain't the place for that.


 
Aye, I quite agree. That's why my first post here was to [try to] explain to Denis or others not familiar with our system, a bit of how it works and avoid specific positions. 

And my query about how the election was portrayed in the foreign press and how it was viewed overseas was meant to steer the thread away from direct political positional comments and more towards a general topic that should allow Nate to head off to the pub without havin' ta grab his mighty mouse and bother himself. :wink:


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## yytsunamiyy (Nov 5, 2008)

Seen from Germany, the media here has made a big deal of it, with, as far as I would be willing and able to judge, a strong bias for Obama. (Not that that matters in any way, shape or form, seeing how for some reasons you forgot to put in your constitution that europeans are allowed to vote as well...)
All through last night the two public channels (about equal to BBC 1 & 2 in the UK) were having live reporters, constant updates, commentaries and so on. The private channels apart from the news channels had some coverage. Print media are full of it.

I for one truly hope that things return to normal soon as I feel we have many more pressing problems right  here in our own house that deserve the coverage. After all, what does it REALLY matter who is the president of the USA to Germany? Whoever it is has to deal with the legacy of George W Bush and is therefore very restricted in the amount of "change" he can bring about. There is a certain feeling of goodwill amongst the Germans for Obama and the hope that he will at least try to mend some broken fences. But the overwhelming feeling is one of happiness and relief that George Walker Bush is about to walk off the world stage.

Edit: I am not taking any sides here


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## DonkeyOte (Nov 5, 2008)

Just echoing Gerald & Barry... yes the election was and still is as we speak big news in the UK, Obama was seen by many as a "positive" choice ... that said in the UK we have a certain (recent yet profound) penchant for younger political leaders -- there has in the past decade or so been only one notable exception to that rule here in the UK (that I can think of at 11pm) namely Sir Menzies Campbell of the Lib Democrats and his tenure was not a long one... older politicians rarely get good press in the UK.  
Disclaimer: the above is by no means meant to be represent a political point merely a general observation of the British press.


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## TinaP (Nov 5, 2008)

As a resident of one of the battleground states (Ohio) I'm glad the election is over.  It's a double-edged sword when the press and candidates pay such close attention to you...at least they ask what is important to you (even if they don't always listen) but it's very intrusive.  

Now the media can go back to commercials for Pocket Fisherman and home beer brewing kits instead of mudslinging.


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## Norie (Nov 5, 2008)

Tina

Excuse my ignorance but what is a 'Pocket Fisherman'?

Is it a small person/elf/faerie that you keep in your pocket and use when you've been dropped into West Sumatra and you're hungry?

And can I buy one on QVC or Ebay?


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## Smitty (Nov 5, 2008)

> what is a 'Pocket Fisherman'?



I'll bet it has to do with RONCO, as in Ron Popeil, the US inventor of all things useless, and probably the originator of the late night infomercial: "but wait, there's more!!!"


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## Greg Truby (Nov 5, 2008)

Norie said:


> Excuse my ignorance but what is a 'Pocket Fisherman'?


 
*WHAT!? * You mean Ron Popeil has not conquered Europe!? 

http://www.ronco.com/rco_prodinfo.aspx?pid=PF100100GENS&color=&active=ascry


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## RichardS (Nov 5, 2008)

Greg,

In response to your question on overseas coverage, here in Australia I reckon you could describe the coverage as comprehensive, if you're conservative. It's been all over the news the last 9 months, with growing intensity as the election drew closer. Yesterday saw live coverage on some TV stations. One of our key public broadcasting current affairs programs, PM on ABC Radio, was broadcasting live from various US locations yesterday as well. Nothing much on the New Zealand general election coming up on Saturday.

I guess the feeling is that what happens in the US has a strong impact on us. America sneezes, the rest of the world catches cold, as it were. The sub-prime crisis in the States has had a huge impact on our stock market and economy, even though our financial institutions are quite sound.

As others have noted, I think the general feeling is relief that Bush is gone, and a change will be good. At the same time, I don't think many people really understood Obamas' policies. They don't take much notice of this sort of stuff in their own country.

Sorry for being so serious about this. I just hope the man is able to improve the situation for the US, that's his job, but also gives some consideration to the impact his decisions may have on the rest of the world.

It'll be good not to have the media saturation we've had, and get back to our own problems.

Cheers,

Richard


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## Smitty (Nov 5, 2008)

It will definitely be nice to have a halt to all of the political ads, and even though I didn't vote for him, he's the President-Elect and I respect the position and wish him the best.

We've all got a lot of uphill challenges, and I certainly hope he can improve the situation for all of us...


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## Jon von der Heyden (Nov 6, 2008)

Ok I'm not a brit but I live in the UK - and neither I nor most of my friends truely understand the US system.  I won't pretend.  But we did have alot of coverage of the campaign, even the Obama / Clinton campaign to become the presidential candidate.

Now that the election is over I'm looking fwd to having my normal garbage returned to my tv screen.


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## Expiry (Nov 6, 2008)

I was thinking this morning that the news channels are going to love the next war that kicks off. 

The headline will be: OBAMA V OSAMA


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## SydneyGeek (Nov 6, 2008)

Greg Truby said:


> Here in the U.S., whenever the press mentions foreign countries and their take on this election, the U.S. press emphasizes that foreigners the world over see Obama's election as having something of a redemptive effect. And that it restores the view of our as a country where anything is possible.
> 
> I'm curious. Is this really how most folks overseas felt? Or is that a bunch of malarkey? Indeed, did the world pay a lot of attention? We're told it did, but our press - while free - ain't always accurate.


 
It got a fair bit of attention in Oz. Most of the people I talked to are happy to see the change, and looking to a different take on US foreign policy. Because of America's influence, it matters. 

And thanks for the comments on the Electoral College system. Regardless of the idea that it's meant to give the smaller States a bigger say, sweeping the big 5 (or 4 out of 5 in Obama's case) got him half-way to the 270. That would have been a long way back for any opponent. 

Denis


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## Long Nose (Nov 6, 2008)

If your take on foreign policy is a reduction in world presence, I agree.  Like our predecessor, I guess you can't keep China British forever.


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## Stormseed (Nov 7, 2008)

*T*he new American President, B Obama, is a strong follower of the Father of our Nation and his name is *Mahatma Gandhi*. 

Besides, Mr. Obama also is very religious, worshipping an Indian Monkey God, *Hanumanji*. I read it somewhere, he regularly reads *Hanuman Chalisa*. 

I am really proud to be an Indian  Jai Hind !!


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